Jazzie B In Conversation With BLK BRIT On Series ‘Camden’
You can not refer to pivotal Black British music without the mention of Jazzie B and the collective Soul II Soul. Among his many accolades and achievements, Jazzie has been awarded an OBE and the inaugural Ivor Novello Award for inspiration. In 2013, an ironwork sculpture of Jazzie was installed at the Portrait Bench alongside other locally iconic figures. Also in his arsenal, Jazzie has lectured at Cambridge University, taught music and music technology at Jamie’s Dream School for Channel 4, and numerous community engaging ventures. Jazzie co-wrote and produced a series of tracks with the ‘Godfather of Soul’ James Brown, Teena Marie and Maxi Priest to name a few. He has remixed for the likes of Public Enemy, Johnny Gill, Incognito and Family Stand’s smash hit ‘Ghetto Heaven.’
These accolades are only a snapshot of the breadth of Jazzie’s momentum, and BLK BRIT had the opportunity to have a conversation with him on his feature in the Camden series out now on Disney+. We delve into its unique music scene, its powerful influence and his wealth of experience which inspired his long-standing career.
Music Producer and DJ, Jazzie B OBE
With the series, what was the process in you joining the Camden documentary project?
“I was invited along to this documentary idea in Camden, I guess because it's my turf. Unu [you] can’t come on my turf and not register! I was told about what the idea was; about this fertile, elevated ground of Camden that seems to be the nectar, the sour-sop of the music industry here in London. In regards to my actual involvement, I was quite taken aback and humbled that some of the participants in the earlier part of the series saw where the director was going with [Camden] and they had mentioned myself and Soul II Soul. My reinforced interest was the fact that it wasn't just regional. There've been lots of documentaries that I’ve been involved in which were quite regional or very BBC led. And here was an opportunity to tell a story with my peers from around the world, so now it's got that worldwide appeal.”
To quote you in the series, you said Camden was “derelic but energy.” Do you think at the moment that it still has that charm for why it became a beacon?
“Nah, can't do that - gentrified now, you know what I mean. We’ve got to evolve as well, that was then and we’re in the now. I guess we were the early voyagers of what I call ‘derelic’; it was all about derelic at that time in the 80’s, because we were just coming out of the idea of the class system and technically speaking the poli-trickens [politicians] had legalised the hustle. Yeah, so it was at a point where I live in this melting pot and London, particularly Camden, is an incredible place when it comes down to this idea of the Arts. When you live it and you're in a community like that, it's got a really interesting frequency. It's such an interesting place because my ethos is, ‘a happy face of thumping bass for a loving race.’ And being one of the destinations we arrived in from the planet art, Camden seemed to really be the micro-center of that melting pot, and the idea within the class system and how we thrive in it. In our working class community, the argument about digging deeper or utilising our resources is part of our innovation, which is part of, in a way, our culture. I've often described London as the shopping window for the rest of the world. When I've travelled, everyone is always amazed by London.”
Totally. So, when you were building your style coming up during that time, you mentioned you took elements of subcultures within Camden, but still representing Caribbean sound system; there's a lot of innovation that happened. Do you feel that people still have that flexibility to create new sounds?
“You know what's weird, when you ask questions like that it's either I'm very selfish or I'm just wearing blinkers, because I don't really know about that, that's not where I reside; I'm just dealing with the I and whatever the I and I is dealing with, so in regards to me giving a view on all of that, I haven't necessarily looked through the window properly there. As a believer of innovation and creation, I keep so many young people kind of close to me, so the idea of there being a rule or a how to do things, I think the time and place dictates what you do. What is interesting is the people I've met on the journey and talking to people like yourselves, people of colour, seeing this whole thing evolve in front of my eyes you know… All this stuff I was taught as a kid, you grow as an adult, the whole change is incredible. And again, a lot of those types of changes are underlined in that documentary, which is again the reason I’m so proud to be a part of it, as well as having experiences from a younger generation, like the director and his vision… I had a lot of input in that kind of, you know.”
I can imagine with your wealth of knowledge and experience.
“Yeah, like the footage of we is our footage. It's not Getty, the BBC or anybody else's. And that was another interesting thing, dealing with Disney, because whoever was doing their due diligence on that level, recognised that - the platform. Because now it was about laying down some tracks, leaving some kind of legacy. The quality and the headroom that these guys dealt with, I’ve not experienced that outside of an independent project. The due diligence was probably second to none in terms of any other things that I’ve been involved with on that level, which again, the essence of what was created and the principles of that era. Look at it now, the future, with your Stormzy’s and all those guys and a generation who are no longer apologising. Rartid, ah me see dat inna my life?! People used to pat my head for good luck! You know what I mean?! … We've grown, man. So I've got a lot to be thankful for. Give blessings every day. Very proud, watching the series and what it represents. But I think more so how it represents and there's a great reflection now on the future and the challenges that journalists face moving forward in terms of describing things, and actually having his-story, rather than fi dem history, yuh simmi?”
Yeah, definitely!
“Yeah that was paramount.”
Jazzie B at the Camden screening
It's a very powerful series; how the story is told very much depends on who's telling the story and that's why it's such a brilliant project. It was lovely to see someone such as yourself because sometimes icons don't always get their flowers while they're here, so it's lovely to have that celebration and that passing down of knowledge directly from the person within a film. Because then it's documented, nobody can alter your words once it's there. Moving on, when you were coming up through that era, did you know the impact that you would have in terms of going over to the United States, helping pave the way for Black artists from the UK to have that acknowledgement? And also the US knowing that they can come over to the UK and understanding that Camden is like a music hub?
“Yeah, yeah, and that's why the first [Soul II Soul] record’s called ‘Volume One’. With knowledge and experiences, the connections have always been close. Like members of my family, back in the 70s, living in houses owned by the Black Muslims like Malcolm X and them people. We used to go to Saturday school and again, there were exchanges made with literature and education… a quarter of my family went to Canada, a quarter went to the Americas and the rest was spread out across the rest of the world. The American side of it always sucked and we knew that, because although we didn't live there, we lived in the belly of our family who were imprisoned in the American system, you know. My aunt had four jobs, two children, no man, and never saw the daylight. Here [in UK] one job: mom, a nurse and dad worked nights, then he got enough income to start up his own little business. Inside of the working-class system, inside of the susu and pardner and church, down the pub and the betting shop, was living a better life than his sibling... And over the years, because of second generation born and raised here, we managed to see the rest of the world and the family that was in Holland and stuff like that. Europeans were thriving much more than the Americans, so I was always aware of the domestic American system. In the 80’s I had a residency in America,Timmy Regisford is my cousin. So, they all linked to the show; Tony Humphries, Larry Levan, all of that kind of soul scene. I was more involved with the Caribbean side, which was still a break because you had all the guys in the disco scene, and a lot of guys in the hip hop or the electro scene in them days. So when I came out with the project, it was already set. And the premise was my sound system, I've always lived that. As a child, my ambition was to be the biggest sound in the world. So the fact that I got to the Americas, I mean, I'm talking from the 70s, we used to go there. I remember going to Hollywood Bowl to see Diana Ross and Michael Jackson in the Wizard of Oz. Aunty Lilly, she worked with the Black Panthers and stuff like that. My family here was quite academic, I'm the kind of dropout- not just me, but anyway, I took a different direction and encompassed all of these things. Our generation was quite clever at amalgamating all the things, you know, and had dreams. But the truth of the matter is, New York, LA, San Francisco, maybe Washington, you can't call that America. It's when you go to the Midwest, awful place; I've experienced Louisiana, Jackson, Mississippi, Dallas… Up until ‘88 we were in and out of America from the Freddie Laker days... In NY I did a residency for like over two years at a club called Mars.”
So interesting, I could have spoken to you for much longer, but last question- how important is it to have these sorts of portrayals of artists? People enjoy the music, but how important is it to actually see and understand the journeys that they've gone on?
“So we can hand it over to the next generation and they can see our evolution. Yeah, that's why it's really important. You were spot on about the stories being told from us and how they're portrayed. Then you know these are coming from the actual source and leaving a legacy. I've learned now as I've grown older how important his-story is, you know. As my parents passed, I'll go back to when they say, ‘you're the elders now.’ There's things our parents didn't necessarily do that we're bitching about, you know, ‘shit I wish I knew that last bit of ingredients for that cake,’ because they never gave you all the information. And technically, that's how it was handed down anyway. And I'm suggesting, now that there's more of us rooted here, that information, that story, those experiences are to aid those other generations coming up. “
And telling a more complete story-
“From you, not from a historian, not from one of these dodgy, you know, people who go around talking about people's artefacts and call themselves anthropologists and stuff like that, the Christopher Columbus's. At least we'll be able to dial in on the dark web, the truth.”(both laugh)
Thank you so much for taking the time out to speak with me. When it came up that it was an opportunity to speak with you, interview aside, I just had to. I'm born in '86, so I grew up listening to you and just from a personal standpoint, seeing the heights that yourself and Soul II Soul reached, it's just so lovely to see that being celebrated, because it was a time!